A Family Affair

History

Horology runs deep in the Roth family. Both Daniel Roth's grandfather and great grandfather were watchmakers in the La Chaux des Fonds region in Neuchatel, Switzerland. Deciding to swap the snowy Jura Mountains for a warmer Mediterranean climate, Daniel's grandfather moved to Nice in the south of France and opened a watch repair business in the sun. Playing and working in the shop from an early age, when the time came for Daniel to select a vocation, watchmaking was an obvious choice and he enrolled in and completed a three year course for budding watchmakers in Nice.

Diploma in hand, it was time to put theory into practice and so Daniel moved to La Vallee de Joux; the centre of the world at that time for ambitious young watchmakers, and for many it remains so today. Daniel initially found work in smaller ateliers, before landing a prized position at Audemars Piguet in La Brassus. He was to spend the next seven years with the company and still regards them very highly. Not yet 30 years old, armed with confidence in his abilities and a good few years of solid experience and training behind him, Daniel heard of an exciting new opportunity and boldly put himself forward...Breguet!

This was no ordinary advertisement, 'Situation Vacant - Watchmaker Wanted'. The Chaumet brothers, Jacques and Pierre, were Parisian jewelers who had bought a very run-down Breguet and planned to restore it to its former glory. At that time in its history, Breguet was virtually nothing but a name; the only sign of horological life was a shop in Paris. Breguet contracted out the few orders for pocket watches they received each year, as they were not equipped to produce them on their own.

The Chaumets envisioned Breguet's future in Switzerland and they needed a very talented watchmaker and manager; not just someone with the energy and skills to revitalize the brand and start a manufacturing capability from scratch; the successful candidate would also need to be a visionary - someone who could immerse themselves in Breguet's history, find and instill the Breguet look and steer the company back to its former greatness.

However talented and experienced he was, the young Daniel Roth would not appear to have the multitude of qualities needed for such a demanding position of responsibility - and he didn't! What did win the Chaumets over was his honesty and openness. Daniel had submitted a two page CV: the first page highlighting his experience and areas of expertise; the second page then listing the skills he thought he lacked for the role - skills, however, he believed he could learn if given the chance. Jacques and Pierre decided that both they and Breguet had found their man and offered the young Daniel the position.

The Chaumets had planned to set up a new workshop for Breguet in La Chaux des Fonds, however, Daniel made it clear that he wasn't moving from his home in Le Sentier, so they left it to him to find something suitable closer to home. With the Chaumets' support, Daniel went back to watch school in Le Sentier for another year to get a solid technical and academic base in complications. At the same time, he studied all he could from the Breguet archives; learning all he could about A.L. Breguet; his work, the company and their watches.

While studying in Le Sentier, Daniel made a perpetual calendar pocket watch, which was sold under the Breguet name and generated sufficient profits to reimburse the Chaumet's investment and expenses for his year's education.

Daniel then went on to introduce the perpetual calendar and tourbillon into Breguet's contemporary wristwatch collection; this re-launched the popularity of these complications among the major brands.

Daniel began designing and building watches for Breguet at a small rented atelier in La Brassus before Breguet bought their own premises.

Inspired by a vintage Breguet pocket watch, Daniel designed and developed the now iconic 3130. He spent his year's holiday allowance developing the power reserve for that model and when he told the Chaumet brothers, he was granted 3 days off for his troubles!

Daniel spent fourteen very rewarding years with Breguet and stamped his imprint on both the watches and the company. The Chaumets, however, ran into legal and business trouble and in 1987 they sold Breguet to an investment company, Investcorp. With the Chaumet brothers in charge, Daniel would have been happy to stay with Breguet for the rest of his working life. When they left however, his passion for working for the company departed with them.

He left Breguet to commence his next big adventure... his own brand - 'Daniel Roth'.

With an inspired distinctive new shape (how often has a new watch form appeared - before or since?), a large loan from the bank and a distribution agreement with Siber Hegner, a Zurich based, international distribution and marketing group, Daniel set about creating his new brand - centred around interesting, innovative, quality timepieces.

The experience and skills he learned at Audemars Piguet and Breguet led Daniel to steer his new company towards quality and innovative design; slowly but surely was the way he saw the new 'Daniel Roth' brand earning respect and building a good reputation. The market was extremely cut-throat and highly competitive lower down the scale - no easy place for a newcomer. Daniel had the drive to make great watches, the facilities to make great watches and most importantly, the skills to make great watches; what could possibly go wrong?

Quite a lot, as it turned out.

A few short years later, new management at Siber Hegner were looking for economies, which led to the directors declaring that the return from the distribution of the 'Daniel Roth' line was insufficient. No thought to the fact that this was a growing brand, gaining more and more respect among connoisseurs with every new model released. The decision was made; the rug was pulled. Daniel's bank panicked when they found out he had lost his major distribution channel and they called in his substantial loans.

Impending disaster was adverted by a 'shining knight' in the form of the Tay family, owners of Singapore's The Hour Glass. Purchasing 51% of the Daniel Roth brand in 1994 (THG also purchased 51% of the Gerald Genta brand in 1996) sufficiently recapitalized the brand.

Utilizing their established Asian networks to distribute the majority of Roth and Genta watches, the early days were financially strong. As a minority partner in the business, Daniel suggests he had little influence on The Hour Glass strategy, which suffered financial losses in the late 1990's, due in part to the struggling Asian economy at that time. In response to those difficult times The Hour Glass sold both the Roth and Genta brands to the Italian jeweler Bvlgari.

Not party to the negotiations, Daniel was presented with a 'fait accompli' and was asked to sign over his remaining shareholdings in the company to Bvlgari, who would only do a deal for 100% ownership. He relinquished his remaining shareholdings in the company and left when his temporary contract expired. Daniel was unsure which direction his future would take at this stage, however, he knew he was finished working for others; Daniel Roth would become his own master once again.

At 55 years old, having achieved more than most men in the industry, Daniel was not giving up. He decided to start again; to design and build the watch that he wanted. His watch would be a testament, not only to his formidable skills; it would display the craftsmanship that he believed was fast disappearing in the modern world of haute-horology. Daniel's new watch was to be one of the very best available - if not the best! Quality and craft would reign supreme. Even for a man who was no stranger to taking large risks, with a family to feed and support, this was a big one!

Consultancy work with Minerva, who were undergoing a transformation and rebirth, helped to pay the bills while Daniel spent 18 months visualizing, designing and developing his new creation. The new company, 'Jean Daniel Nicolas' would be a family affair. Jean, Daniel's son, had inherited his patience and steady hands and was joining Daniel in an apprenticeship. Nicolas, Daniel's wife and a former watchmaker, would try to keep the two men moving in the right direction and add her considerable skills and experience to the new enterprise.

(Note: Jean is pronounced like John with a soft J and Nicolas is pronounced Nicola)

Word of what they were doing spread slowly through the close-knit world of connoisseurs of haute-horology. Daniel sat down at his bench and started work; patiently making parts; cutting, filing and polishing. Slowly design met function; 18 months of work; the realization of a dream; the Jean Daniel Nicolas Two-Minute Tourbillon was born.

Interview

IanS: Looking back at the route you took to get where you are today Daniel, it appears to have been be a very twisted and bumpy road; was it worth it?

DR: I cannot say I planned things to go the way they did, and things did not always go - if ever - as planned. I think though, that perhaps the experiences I had, both good and bad (smiles), were all necessary to get me here now.

IanS: And are you happy with your life now; how it has all turned out?

DR: Very - Happy and content. There are always pressures, however, the pressure now comes from within rather than outside influences. For the first time in many, many years, I am not only free from (most) outside pressures; I am able to devote all my energies into doing what I want to do.

IanS: Which is...?

DR: (Laughter) Making beautiful watches. I feel fortunate that I have been given another chance and I just want to work and work and make the most of it.

IanS: Your son, Jean, is your apprentice now; how is that working out?

DR: Very well. I had some hard, strict teachers in my youth; at times perhaps too hard, and while I would not wish that on anyone, they did instill in me the attitude of not accepting 'good enough'. Everything had to be done correctly - over and over and over until it was 'just right'. I think that attitude is lacking among many new watchmakers today. Constraints of time and money have led to modern training being rushed; assembly takes over from manufacture and craft. There is nothing wrong if a watchmaker chooses not to do the very best they can - not all watches need be, should be, or can be the most expensive and the best. What I lament is that the young are not choosing; they are not able to choose! The tragedy is that they just do not know what their best could be. If I do my job correctly, Jean will know! (Smiles)

Jean was getting bored with the cutting and filing exercises I had been giving him recently, so I gave him a small pendulum clock and asked him to skeletonize it instead of the exercises. It is a much more interesting way to learn - and harder. He is using the piercing saw of his great-grandfather to cut out the plates!

IanS: You chose to make a (two-minute) tourbillon as the first offering under your new brand 'Jean Daniel Nicolas'; why a tourbillon? Everyone seems to be doing tourbillons these days.

DR: Nobody is doing a tourbillon like mine! (Laughing) Tourbillons are very special to me; I have a strong affinity for tourbillons. I feel tourbillons are alive; they give a watch joy and soul. They make me happy when I see them moving.

IanS: What is special to you about this new watch?

DR: Everything! (Laughing) Its elegance, its femininity - It smiles at me and makes me smile back.

IanS: Why a two-minute tourbillon?

DR: The development of the movement, the technical aspects, ran concurrently with the design of the case and dial. I did not develop the movement and then afterwards design the case and dial. The watch i.e. movement and case, was designed as one complete piece. When I started to think about using the tourbillon cage for the seconds, it would not work with a one-minute tourbillon as only 180 degrees was visible (the tourbillon bridge covers the top half). A two-minute rotation gave me the possibility to have the design I liked. It looks like a retrograde seconds - but isn't. In that instance it was function (two minute rotation) following form (180 degrees available for seconds).

The double arches, under the tourbillon bridge is an example of the contrary - form following function. Without those high curves, you could not see the 0 and 60 second marks.

The movement inspired and influenced the case and vice-versa.

IanS: Could you tell me a little bit more about your new watch?

DR: It is a Two-Minute Tourbillon with a 60 hour Reserve de Marche - 38mm diameter in the round version and 32mm x 42mm for the form, 11.4mm high and available (at present) in pink gold or platinum. 18,000 bpm.

IanS: Why 18,000 bpm?

PD: Mainly because I like to see the balance beating. A slow beat watch is harder to regulate than a fast beating one and I did not want to do anything too easy! (Laughing) It is nice to be able to see the tourbillon cage rotating and the balance beating. A strong heart and a slow pulse!

IanS: How important is accuracy to you in a handcrafted watch such as this?

DR: I think you need a certain level of accuracy - above all else it is a watch first so it should tell the time well! (Smiling) Personally I would not be happy with more than 3 or 4 seconds a day error.

IanS: Do you think a tourbillon adds to accuracy in a wristwatch?

DR: Perhaps in its original form the tourbillon was useful, though there has always been debate about even that. In a wristwatch I do not think it adds to better timekeeping. A faster beat rate would be much more effective - and much easier! I do not make tourbillons for that reason, I make them because of the craft involved and how they make me feel.

IanS: Why the round version? When people think of Daniel Roth they tend to think of a unique form.

DR: (Laughing) It is a unique form! At 'Daniel Roth' we occasionally received requests from potential clients for round cases; they liked our complications and style but not the form, so I knew that some demand was there. Because I anticipated that the market for my new watch would be small - and I did not wish to lose any precious clients who wanted a round case (laughing) - I decided to offer the watch in the two shapes.

Another motive, as strong as the first, was the challenge of making something special, something unique, in a round case. I suppose part of the drive for the new form watch was to show that the last time (with the 'Daniel Roth' brand) was not a lucky 'one off'; I wanted to show that I could do something unique once again - even better! With a round case the challenge is even harder than with a form watch - virtually everybody is trying to do something different in a round watch - how many really achieve that goal? I believe that anyone seeing one of my round case watches will both see and feel that it is very special and unique.

I should point out as well that there are two distinct movements: round and form. There is no spacer involved! (laughing)

IanS: Your movement has a 3/4 plate; why did you choose that over the more 'traditional' Swiss bridges?

DR: I felt that the 3/4 plate went better technically with the tourbillon. It also pleased me aesthetically as well. The dial side is elegant, rich in texture and multi-dimensional. I like the contrast having a comparatively austere back.

IanS: There appears to be something special about those Geneva waves; what is it?

DR: Hand-crafted Geneva waves are usually 'wave like'(laughing).When applied, the following wave overlaps the first; you can see that the lines start low and finish high - like a wave! Mine are symmetrical; they do not overlap; they look like a broad U shape.

IanS: Is there any reason for that?

DR: It is the hardest finish of that type to do. I do not know of anyone making waves like that. It is very difficult, so naturally I did that! (Laughing) I want this watch to be a testimony to as much craft as I can possibly put into it; craft that is disappearing. If I can do these things, then others will know that they can be done - though they might not know how!

(Laughing)

IanS: You appear to spend a lot of time polishing tiny parts; just how polished do they have to be?

DR: First making; then finishing. I want my movements to be as perfect as I can possibly make them. As I have made only a few movements to date - well nearly a few - two (laughing), I am still learning just how good the finish can be. Some parts I have polished for over a week because I can see still them getting better and better by the day. A client, in all probability, could not see the difference between two days polishing and ten days polishing - I can, however, and that's what counts. I stop polishing when the finish stops improving. It drives Nicolas (his wife) crazy sometimes: over a week on one small part! (Shakes his head in disbelief) I cannot stop if I feel I could do better.

IanS: How good do you think that your level of finishing is? There are some superbly finished watches available and more and more connoisseurs appreciate a superb finish; how do you compare your watches with the competition?

DR: I do not believe that there are any contemporary watches available as well finished as these I am making. It is not just a question of the skill; skill which is getting rarer and rarer - it is the time and money! It is just not economical to finish parts to the level I am doing now; it takes too long and most people and clients cannot even see the difference! I will never become rich making watches like this - but that is not the goal - I have a chance to make superb watches and I just want to make the very best watches I possibly can.

IanS: Would you let us in to some of your secrets to achieving these high levels of finish?

DR: It is fairly straight forward when you know the main tricks.

1.Never try for a fine finish on a dry day; I always wait for rain or cloud and fortunately that is fairly frequent in La Vallee de Joux! (Laughing)

2.The mix of alloys of the 'zinc' being used is very important and little appreciated these days.

3.Years and years of patience, practice and skill. Once you have achieved what you are after the first time it gets easier because you know it can be done. Before that it can be heartbreaking! It is much harder than it looks - which is why many collectors appreciate fine finishing.

note: to illustrate the time and effort that goes into finishing of the very highest level, when interviewed by Jaw last year, Francois-Paul Journe, whose stunning watches are the envy of many, responded to a question on his finishing with, 'Philippe Dufour told me just the other day that my finishing quality is now good enough (laughter). I can do even better, but my production cost may increase by 3 times...'

IanS: You have finished two watches now (a round and a form) and you have a full order book; how many watches do you hope to make per year?

DR: These first two watches have taken about twelve months (discounting design). Perhaps I can do three in the next twelve months. Many very well respected watchmakers talk about making "x" number of parts in-house. I do not know of anyone else making as many of their pieces in their own atelier as I am doing at present. If I bought more parts from outside and finished them here it would be much faster - but they would not be as handcrafted. Would the watch be as special? Not to me. Virtually every piece I make is made exactly to fit its partners, not just to be fitted in a movement of the same type. Perhaps in a few years I can make 5 per year - who knows? It doesn't matter about the numbers - quality and craft will always come first. I want this watch to have as much of me in it as is possible.

How can I teach Jean if I do not show him myself?

IanS: I have heard very little in the press or on the Internet about what you have been doing - and much of what I have read has been rumour; how have your clients found you?

DR: In Japan, a few people have been following what I have been doing since I left 'Daniel Roth'. One (Hong Kong) client has followed me since Breguet and said that if I made a new watch he would buy it - and he did! I hadn't even started thinking about the design then! (Laughing) I have already had a few Japanese reporters and photographers visit and an article published in the Japanese press.

IanS: Europe and the USA?

DR: No, there is not the same culture of appreciation of excellence and craftsmanship - generally I mean - in Europe and America .There are individuals (in the west) who appreciate what I do, but not as many as in Japan/Asia. It is still early days so perhaps that will change. It is very hard to make generalizations when you have only sold a few watches! (Laughing)

We did have an article posted on ThePuristS.com internet site by Curtis Thomson after a visit here last year. That article resulted in an early order, so thank you to Curtis and ThePuristS.

IanS: Do you follow what is discussed in the watch web sites?

DR: No (laughing), we have no email or Internet connected - not yet anyway. My fax machine is the most high-tech machine here! Any spare money goes into equipment for making watches.

IanS: Where have your clients come from; individuals or dealers?

DR: Individual collectors. I have had offers from retailers wanting to buy up to five watches per year, however, even if I wanted to sell more watches, I do not have the time to make them! (Smiling) I do have a distributor in Japan (who also handles Philippe Dufour). One of the effects of the big brands taking more control over their own distribution and retailing (with Boutiques, etc), is that it is easier for high quality independents to get shelf space. I seem to get a call a week from someone wishing to sell my watches. At present, however, that is not necessary, I prefer to make and sell fewer watches but directly to clients if I can. It is much better having a direct relationship with the client. At present it is working well like that and my watches deserve to know where they are going. I am happier making a special piece for somebody when I know who they are - putting a face to a dial!

IanS: I read a rumour last year that you were planning to join the AHCI when you had a finished watch and had something to show; is that the case?

DR: No, joining the AHCI is not part of my immediate plans. The main reason for me to join would have been for the publicity; to present to the public at Basel and try and meet potential clients. As I am already selling more than I can make, I do not see the point at the moment. Perhaps one day (smiles). I am really working flat out at present and any time I would have to spend in Basel is time lost making watches.

IanS: How is your relationship with Mr.Hayek and the Swatch group? I imagine you still need to source some parts?

DR: Yes, Nivarox was one of the first companies I had to contact when I had the idea to set up again. It is virtually impossible for a business of this size to make balances and balance springs. I wrote a letter to Nivarox asking if I could buy some balances and they responded quite quickly; I was informed that there was no problem. I immediately placed an order for 1000 balances.

IanS: 1000 balances! That seems a lot for an atelier this size doesn't it?

DR: Yes, I thought that I had better profit while Mr.Hayek was in a good mood with me (smiling). Those balances should keep us supplied for generations (laughing)!

IanS: What is your feeling towards your old company 'Daniel Roth'? Is it hard seeing your name on a company that is no longer yours?

DR: 'Daniel Roth' has not been (100%) mine for a long time. Under the ownership of 'The Hour Glass', I had quite a lot of autonomy, however, things changed when the company was sold to Bvlgari. There have been some problems because of my name - but I cannot help that! Hopefully that is finished. I have turned the page on 'Daniel Roth' and am working towards a new future - I hope they can do the same. The company 'Daniel Roth' will always be special to me, as so much of me went into it.

IanS: Do you have a philosophy that has guided you through the years?

DR: To do my very best; to keep learning and to pass on what I know. I have always strived to make the very best watches I could at the time. I could not sleep easily if I knew I could have done better. More important still I believe, is to impart the knowledge I have to a new generation. I know Jean has the skill to be a great watchmaker; if I haven't transferred my knowledge to him then that will be my fault - not his.

IanS: When you retire and look back at what you have done; what will you hope to have accomplished?

DR: I will be happy if people think that I have made some good watches and I feel confident that I have passed my knowledge on. No, not some good watches; many very good watches and a few superb watches! (Laughing) I hope these watches I am making now will be some of the very best available anywhere.

IanS: And the future; do you have other projects in mind for another model or complication?

DR: My head is full of ideas - sometimes too many! At the moment I am concentrating on these two models. It is only the beginning and I have invested a lot of my time, energy and money getting this far. I need to sell a few watches to recoup that investment before I think of starting something new!

IanS: Thank you very much Daniel for being so generous with your time and for such a frank and informative talk.

DR: My pleasure. Thank you.

Ian Skellern - April 2004

I cannot thank the Roth family enough for their time, kindness and hospitality. Every visit was both a pleasure and an incredible learning experience. If they were sick of hearing me say, 'Just one more question', it never showed.

Special thanks as well to Curtis Thomson and Max Hellicar, both of whom were instrumental in getting this interview to a standard I could not have hoped to achieve alone.

Special note: This interview was conducted in French. We welcome comments, suggestions, and corrections to this article.